4 PARA reputation/relationship with regs?

Collieryboy

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Evening gents,
Please excuse the slightly cheeky thread title. I know its been asked on other forums and someone wondering the same may find this later via a search.
Coming from the RM forum there seems to be a bit of a strained relationship between the RMR and the regs. The RMR seem to really align their training as close to regular as possible with the same exercises and exact same commando course. What is the reputation and relationship like between 4 para and the regs?
From my limited conversations with a few reg lads the majority seems to be "you'll be respected if you can do your job well, or are ex-regular", but have had the odd very negative opinion, even "dont bother".
I don't want to start a potentially negative thread, just would like to hear some opinions. It seems the subject of reserves divides opinion, regardless of capbadge.
 

Nutter

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Excellent question and one I had myself. Not that my wee delicate ego can’t take a bit of ripping but considering how tied 4 PARA are to the Regs in terms of role it’s an important point. It’s one thing to call them a bunch of weekend warriors but it’s another think all together if it darts opportunities. Keen to hear
 

Collieryboy

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Excellent question and one I had myself. Not that my wee delicate ego can’t take a bit of ripping but considering how tied 4 PARA are to the Regs in terms of role it’s an important point. It’s one thing to call them a bunch of weekend warriors but it’s another think all together if it darts opportunities. Keen to hear
Definitely mate. Obviously a good bit of banter is inevitable regardless, its expected and I dont think anyone considering joining 4para would be put off by the thought of some piss taking. I just mean more of the overall relationship. Admittedly its only been a couple of blokes opinions but a couple of very negative opinions gives food for thought. To be fair I'm sure its not just a para reg thing. Ive seen and heard it with regards to RMR from friends. I asked one friend the same question about RMR and he tried to be diplomatic and said its good for trips to Norway, rides in helicopters and getting to shoot.
 

Mac_t1lt

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Evening gents,
Please excuse the slightly cheeky thread title. I know its been asked on other forums and someone wondering the same may find this later via a search.
Coming from the RM forum there seems to be a bit of a strained relationship between the RMR and the regs. The RMR seem to really align their training as close to regular as possible with the same exercises and exact same commando course. What is the reputation and relationship like between 4 para and the regs?
From my limited conversations with a few reg lads the majority seems to be "you'll be respected if you can do your job well, or are ex-regular", but have had the odd very negative opinion, even "dont bother".
I don't want to start a potentially negative thread, just would like to hear some opinions. It seems the subject of reserves divides opinion, regardless of capbadge.
If I was to take a stab at it (get it?..Stab) I’d guess it’s just strictly banter mate more often than not, which is pretty much expected and essential to comradery. If lads had a genuine gripe towards a reservist(s) then he or they are either mega poop at the job, or have an overinflated sense of importance (maybe?) amongst other possibilities but I suspect it’s very rarely personal. When shit hits the fan it’s all out the window and everyone shares equal risk and responsibility. If you can take the piss out of yourself just as well then no dramas. I told a mate I was looking to join as a res a while back and he goes ‘ahhhhhh, half hat’ 😂 his delivery was absolutely superb
 

Collieryboy

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If I was to take a stab at it (get it?..Stab) I’d guess it’s just strictly banter mate more often than not, which is pretty much expected and essential to comradery. If lads had a genuine gripe towards a reservist(s) then he or they are either mega poop at the job, or have an overinflated sense of importance (maybe?) amongst other possibilities but I suspect it’s very rarely personal. When shit hits the fan it’s all out the window and everyone shares equal risk and responsibility. If you can take the piss out of yourself just as well then no dramas. I told a mate I was looking to join as a res a while back and he goes ‘ahhhhhh, half hat’ 😂 his delivery was absolutely superb
Half hat haha
 

Nutter

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Definitely mate. Obviously a good bit of banter is inevitable regardless, its expected and I dont think anyone considering joining 4para would be put off by the thought of some piss taking. I just mean more of the overall relationship. Admittedly its only been a couple of blokes opinions but a couple of very negative opinions gives food for thought. To be fair I'm sure its not just a para reg thing. Ive seen and heard it with regards to RMR from friends. I asked one friend the same question about RMR and he tried to be diplomatic and said its good for trips to Norway, rides in helicopters and getting to shoot.

I’m ex I R Irish mate and very occasionally we had some 2 RIR accompany us on ex and the general feel amongst the lads was that they were overly keen, civvie, older guys who wouldn’t cut it as regs. There were some good ones but some real choppers. I never deployed with any though or worked with them much. It was just a given that if you had to work with them there was a fair bit of tutting and eye rolling. But I’ve a feeling that 4 PARA may be a bit different as the boys will have passed p coy, winged up and have been through the mill too. Plus they seem much more likely to work alongside 2 or 3 PARA?
 

Aldo

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My ambition would be to impress regs if I was working with them
 

Nutter

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I've worked with regulars who wouldn’t last a day in civvie street so it works both ways
 

Mackers

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Hand on heart I’ve never had an issue. I think it comes down to the individual and by and large it’s easy to spot if a bloke is willing to put the work in and graft especially if he is on FTRS. They tend to be a different type of bloke but that’s expected
 

Hammerhead26

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Its all a spectrum. Your going to get amazing blokes at one end and bags of you know what at the other and those who are average, above average and those scraping by in-between. Regs or reserve regardless.

Couple that with every varying degree of personality traits humans posses, you will always get mixed reviews based on peoples experiences.

Bottom line its all down to the indervidual competence and willingness as the "other" to assimilate with working with the regs.

Thats how I view it.
 

Collieryboy

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Tbh the two posts above me are very similar to what ive heard from others. Im happy to be judged as an individual then im in control of my own performance. Cant say fairer than that really.
 

Nutter

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Tbh the two posts above me are very similar to what ive heard from others. Im happy to be judged as an individual then im in control of my own performance. Cant say fairer than that really.

I think a lot of your AR experience comes down to a good PSI too mate. A proactive Reg NCO willing to commit to the lads
 

Tony_m

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As a former SNCO I certainly didn’t look down on 4 PARA. They fill a need and in my experience they put the right amount of pressure on themselves to live up to the standard that is required. Are they as well trained and proficient as a regular? No of course they aren’t. That takes full time work but do they have the right foundations and the ability to come up to speed. Yes. Look at the contributions of 4 PARA on HERRICK 8
 

Mac_t1lt

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As a former SNCO I certainly didn’t look down on 4 PARA. They fill a need and in my experience they put the right amount of pressure on themselves to live up to the standard that is required. Are they as well trained and proficient as a regular? No of course they aren’t. That takes full time work but do they have the right foundations and the ability to come up to speed. Yes. Look at the contributions of 4 PARA on HERRICK 8
A few Qs Tony. Were the differences in soldier quality evident between regs and res and if so where would you see this & how long would a res need to bridge the proficiency gap? or is this down to individual capability and other factors? I’ve read about some reservists getting to a level of competency that pretty much required them to go regs to build upon the skills they’ve acquired. Im interested as (not sure if mentioned or stated in other threads) it could suck if your ability to progress is hindered due to being a res which is probably why some lads bounce over.
 

Collieryboy

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As a former SNCO I certainly didn’t look down on 4 PARA. They fill a need and in my experience they put the right amount of pressure on themselves to live up to the standard that is required. Are they as well trained and proficient as a regular? No of course they aren’t. That takes full time work but do they have the right foundations and the ability to come up to speed. Yes. Look at the contributions of 4 PARA on HERRICK 8
Thanks for this Tony. Out of interest how much is the difference to be able to get up to a regular counterparts level? I think the RM give their reserves about 4 weeks before any sort of deployment with the regs.
 

Big_Shep

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You will have frequent opportunities to train with the regular battalions and wider brigade assets throughout the year. The annual training cycle is very good and you’ll have plenty on throughout the year. What ever regular battalion is assuming the high readiness Air Manoeuvre BG reponsibility there will always be requirments for 4 PARA to support. Personal experience is that they were very good at giving you notice allowing you to plan in advance. Outside of the annual camp and routine training weekends there are opportunities depending on your availability to attend longer stints with regulars. For a recent example in 2019 4 PARA deployed over to Croatia for a number of weeks as part of 3 PARA’s battle group for Ex SWIFT RESPONSE. Working with French Airborne and the US 82nd Airborne.
There are also FTRS contracts available ranging from 12-24 Months with 2 and 3 PARA.

You simply don’t have the same time to train to the same intensity as regulars. The skill gap can be closed quite quick with a good pre deployment package or time with OPTAG. There will be training objectives that must be met ahead of deploying with regulars that are set by brigade (?) and include things like all MATTs in date, APWT, range packages, UGL, LMG, pistol, LFMT at section and Pl level by day and night, fitness assessments like the new style RFT and CFTs etc. The system works and you will be brought up to speed. Full disclosure I left in 2017

Shep
 

Collieryboy

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I've worked with regulars who wouldn’t last a day in civvie street so it works both ways
Ive got mate who an ML in the RM. He wouldn't last a day on civvy Street as you say. Hes already about 15 years in and won't leave now as he would really struggle. Like you say, works both ways.
 

Nutter

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Ive got mate who an ML in the RM. He wouldn't last a day on civvy Street as you say. Hes already about 15 years in and won't leave now as he would really struggle. Like you say, works both ways.
Swings and roundabouts mate. End of the day if you put the work in and are a regular attender at 4 PARA I think we’ll get on fine. Individuals will dislike individuals but on the whole their seems to be a good relationship between the AR/Reg battalions.
 
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